The first came in an email from a contact. He is not with A4e, and I won't mention the provider. He has come up against the generic CV, imposed on him by his "adviser". Given his qualifications and experience the client is far better qualified to design a document than this employee, but the company has given out a template and has to stick to it. The client is afraid that it will damage his prospects of getting a job. Of course, when he sends out applications off his own bat he can enclose his own CV. But the problem now is that the companies appear to be sending out CVs to employers without the knowledge or consent of the clients. And we know that these generic CVs end up in the bin.
That leads me to an article I found on the People Management website. It starts by saying that it's too early to judge the success of the Work Programme. But it goes on to describe what it sees as a success story. The provider is Ingeus. They have a contract with TNT Post, which has taken on 90 staff through the WP. The TNT chap says, "We've found that they have developed a work ethic because they have attended the welfare-to-work courses to get them to a job-ready state.” Think about what that implies. They didn't have a "work ethic" before. It gets worse. "Development continues once they are in post because the Ingeus 'work adviser' – who sits within TNT’s recruitment team – maintains the personal relationship. 'She supports each person throughout their training and continues to have one-to-ones with them once they have got the job. It’s like a life-coaching service for that person.'"
What could possibly be wrong with that? People who didn't have a job now have one. The company which will make money by keeping them in work is on hand to support them. So why am I uneasy? Ingeus isn't the only company to have contracts of this kind with employers. So it depends which provider you're sent to what job opportunities you'll get. And the amount of control you can exercise over your life shrinks inexorably. You would be right to feel that you're just a commodity, to be bought and sold.
This is to a point included in this article,I was scheduled for a "session" on Monday ,it turned out to be a re-re-re-twiking of my CV,the Lady was pleasant..After listing my qualifications I was instructed to reduce them,as this was confusing,I complied.I tried to explain that I wrote a new CV that related to each position that I applied for based on my experience. After a edited version was "Approved" I am now qualified as a Cleaner,Building Custodian or Parking lot attendant...
ReplyDelete"He has come up against the generic CV, imposed on him by his "adviser". Given his qualifications and experience the client is far better qualified to design a document than this employee, but the company has given out a template and has to stick to it. The client is afraid that it will damage his prospects of getting a job. Of course, when he sends out applications off his own bat he can enclose his own CV. But the problem now is that the companies appear to be sending out CVs to employers without the knowledge or consent of the clients. And we know that these generic CVs end up in the bin."
ReplyDeleteThis exact same thing has happened to me. My (now former) "advisor" complained to me about the Cv I'd sent her, saying it was too long; and told me she was going to make changes to it if I didn't.
I explained to her that it was a "template" and that I edit it to suit the employer's requirements. I also told her that my previous advisor had had no problem with my usual course of action, she barked "He's no longer your advisor - I AM. I've had TWO YEARS of working in W2W and I'm the expert here!" and proceeded to tell me it was my fault I hadn't received many replies.
This was not a week after she sent me for an interview/assessment where nobody knew about my presence.(At the start of this meeting she told me I was the 6th or 7th person this had happened to but offered no apology or rescheduling)
"So much for your two years in W2W" I said.
Anyway, I wasn't having any of it. I was then taken into the "business leader's" office and he more or less ordered (I think his tone suggested that I'd be sanctioned if I refused) me to use her version of the Cv (which had been emailed to me)
On getting home and opening my email, I was horrified to see that my phone number was wrong, there were several spelling mistakes, "bullet points" that she'd been so insistent upon had been repeated, and to cap it all, when I worked for royal mail I wasn't a postman - oh no - I was a "warehouse team leader"!??.
I complained to the area manager who couldn't even do me the courtesy of spelling my name right, and then to the "director of UK operations" who merely paid lip service to my complaint, and didn't even get back to me with the result of my complaint.
And after almost 11months of using her Cv, I'm still no closer to finding a job.
"...when I worked for royal mail I wasn't a postman - oh no - I was a "warehouse team leader"!??."
ReplyDeleteIt is a criminal offence to falsify your CV in order to obtain a job. (Section 2 of the Fraud Act 2006 - fraud by false representation). If they are sending out your CV knowing it to be false then they are committing a criminal offence. You should complain to the DWP that your provider is committing a criminal offence and you do not wish to be implicated in it. It may also be worth copying the letter to the Parliamentary committee investigating the Work Programme, as this will make the DWP take your complaint more seriously.
The CBI recently published a report entitled “Work in Progress: fulfilling the potential of the Work Programme” (link to pdf below). The CBI believes that the Work Programme “represents a good deal for jobseekers, employers and the taxpayer and has great potential”. Page 23 of the report states:
ReplyDelete“It ...needs to be less burdensome for employers to take on a jobseeker from the Work Programme. At present, providers are having to contact employers repeatedly so they can evidence to DWP that jobseekers they have placed in employment are still working. This constant contact is damaging provider relationships with employers to the point that they no longer want to engage.”
A comment which, I suppose, leads on to an overwhelming question: is it possible that attachment to a Work Programme provider is, in many cases, having a detrimental effect on jobseekers’ ability to secure sustainable employment?
“Work in Progress”:
http://www.cbi.org.uk/media/1668816/Work_in_progress_-_fulfilling_the_potential_of_the_Work_Programme.pdf
"A comment which, I suppose, leads on to an overwhelming question: is it possible that attachment to a Work Programme provider is, in many cases, having a detrimental effect on jobseekers’ ability to secure sustainable employment?"
DeleteVarious people, including myself, have posted on here that just the mention of the fact you are with A4E can mean that an employer won't hire you full stop. I don't know if this is the case for other providers though, given that a lot of this is due to the bad press A4E got.
http://www.cipfa.org.uk/regions/mid/download/CIPFA_pre_employment_21_Sept.pdf
ReplyDeleteExamples of prison sentances ranging from 2 to 15 years for CV fraud given by the Chartered Institute of finance professionals. Obviously can be sued for financial loss by the employer also.
Fraud list (custodial sentance):
Falsifying or exaggerating qualifications
Falsification or omission of information during the pre-employment process.
Undisclosed Convictions
Illegal Workers
False References
Identity Theft
A person lies about qualifications in order to obtain employment.
Fraud by false representation (Section 2)
A person fails to disclose a criminal conviction to obtain employment.
Fraud by failing to disclose information (Section 3)
If an individual does this for financial advantegous - they will face a prison sentance. If a provider does this to gain payments from Government, the adviser is now liable to face a criminal prosecution?
I sent my adviser my cv.. 4 months later they tell me they couldnt open the document, so they had to retype it up from a hard copy I gave them..
ReplyDeleteI don't think any of this is worth worrying about.
ReplyDeleteI'm a Work Programme customer with A4E. I don't think they are bothering to send out fraudulent, "dumbed down" versions of my CV because my strong impression is that A4E are too lazy to do such a thing. Also, it is easy enough to dumb down a CV so that it does not mention academic qualifications but in my case that would also require complete fiction about my work-experience during the last 30 years.
I don't believe A4E are doing this because I have not had a single invitation to an interview on the strength of a fictitious CV sent out by A4E. Were I ever to receive such an invitation, I would trot along to the interview armed with all the certificates etc that prove my real qualifications. I cannot be prosecuted for telling a prospective employer the truth.
Regarding the chap with his CV. Would the advisor doling out buy a 'generic car', go to a 'generic restaurant' and order a 'generic meal' or wear 'generic clothes'? Or would they buy the best they could reasonably afford?
ReplyDeleteI had this problem with an advisor. I rewrote and redesigned my CV. I also saved my CV in PDF format (which is a standard universal file format) and made sure no one could make changes by password protecting it and restricting it so no one could print or copy selected text. I have the full Adobe Acrobat Pro program so could easily do this.
As the advisor could not print or copy text from my CV, she asked if I could send her a version in Word format asked for my CV in MS Word format. I asked her why? She said "so I can tweak it and to send to employers". I refused as she showed sheer incompetence in her general dealing with me. In short, I'd not trust her to write a shopping list! "Do what you want then" was her final response.
Generic CV's and those edited so the client cannot have any personal input are just extra reasons why the WP is not fit for purpose. It all just smacks of a dumbed down one size fits all approach and sheer laziness.
A CV should be anything but generic! It should be a short profile of one's abilities and experience. Who's best to write and construct this? The person concerned, that's who.
As this case of Historian's contact and the experiences of other posters clearly demonstrate, the client has to take control of all personal data. This starts with the initial contact with the WP provider* in refusing to sign any DPA release forms (which is an optional part of any so called "agreement"). This may involve preparing your own agreement beforehand with a clause explicity limiting what data can be stored and distributed to third parties.
ReplyDeleteOn my second session with A4e, I had already printed out my own version of an agreement - On having to sit through numpty reading out the standard A4e agreement, line by line, I presented him with my version and requested that he signed it. To cut a long story short, they refused my version and clean forgot to bully me in to signing theirs.
*) The WP provider could claim that they are acting on behalf of the DWP, so any DPA release signed at the Job Centre covers their activities - To counter this little stunt, the DWP also need to be restricted to only the data required to process your claim. Not easy unless you are a new signee.
Phone calls/emails. from work coaches "Have you applied for this job,? i wonder if work coackes phone employers and say "has joe blogs, applied for this job im their work coach and im just checking? now how does that sound to an employer? yes it sounds like the work programme "client" does not want the job. i myself keep all job i want from them so as not to spoil my chances of potential employment.
ReplyDeleteThis reminds me of the job centre. i got an interview out of the area i live so asked them to pay expenses. they did but then rang the company to see if i had an interview lined up before i went.
Deleteto cut a long story short this call was given as the reason i didn't get the job. according to the company i got to the last 2 but they felt the job centre didn't trust me so doubts set in if they could.
I was fuming and the job centre just said oh well at least you will know better next time you get an interview!
As part of my WP agreement with my advisor, I forward email applications to her. All she does at my appointment, is type them up,and then arranges another appointment in a month or so's time. She tells me she's forwarded my details to prospective employers (Who never reply - quite probably because of the reasons given in this thread imo) and that's it.
DeleteAnyway, I digress - I haven't told her about the two interviews I've made it to since being with WP until after I've been for them.
Nor do I intend to tell her if I've been successful in future (I'll gladly forego the travelling expense to the interview).